Atheist WAR!!!

As soon as you read this, you'll understand where the previous "report" came from.

Over almost a year, I've been having a discussion with a really bright but REALLY resistant (to evidence) friend.

This friend claims that certain murderous assholes - Stalin and Mao,who my friend claims were atheists themselves - waged genocide in their countries in the name of atheism. My friend smartly did not include Hitler, who many suggest was an atheist but who was not only a very devout and outspoken catholic, he was buddy-buddy with the pope of the time - and that partnership is how the vatican came by a very large cache of art, artefacts and gold.

The idea that Mao and Stalin incited war and genocide in the name of atheism is utterly false. Despite my having asked for substantiation, none has been offered, nor have any links to substantiation been proffered. So, for the moment, until my friend can provide any support for the suggestion of genocide motivated by atheism, I claim bullshit.

This argument, that Mao and Stalin, among others, lead atheist wars, has been put forth by any number of others, but none of them has produced any evidence to support their claims either. If my friend can produce viable evidence, legions of people who hate us (us being people who have no beliefs and require evidence for claims) will be crowing from the roofs of their religious buildings, and the current Prada-loving, fur-sporting pope and his baby-raping ranks of dress-wearing liars, and the legions of uneducated fools who call themselves protestant ministers will be right up there with them.

I really, really like this friend, who has a very excellent mind, generally, but who, in this particular area, is highly resistant to even acknowledging the facts that exist and are obvious.  If I didn't care much about this friend, I'd let it go but I suspect a very human basis for this friend clinging to their very holey (not to be confused with holy) paradigm - being an authoritarian and abusive parent, now deceased.

The current conversation, you may be surprised to understand, sprung from my having posted a hilarious (in a really disturbing way) YouTube of Dr. Richard Dawkins reading his hate mail, surrounded by students, who obviously love him.

It is hilarious because Dr. Dawkins speaks with a very educated, Oxfordian accent. It is disturbing, as the letters he reads are from christians who wish Dr. Dawkins all manner of death and destruction: not very christian.... or maybe very christian, given how bloody often christians, those peaceful, loving people, scream and yell for the murder and death of anyone who disagrees with them or has the audacity to ask for the slightest evidence.

By the way, if I come off sounding angry, you'd be right; I am. The more people make idiotic suggestions they refuse to back up, and to which they add insults about my intelligence, the more I am angry.

It is 2012. Our international scientific community has shown humans endlessly fascinating, substantiated, undeniable FACTS about us, our planet and our universe: that humans in first-world countries persist in believing in ridiculous fantasies that have murder and genocide at their core - it is BEYOND ME and yeah, it totally pisses me off.

This is today's excerpt from the conversation:

Tell you what: prove me wrong. Dig me up something researched, supported and verified, that supports the idea any of those regimes you mentioned killed people in the name of atheism. The possibility the main players were atheists has no bearing on their murderous regimes unless there is evidence they said/wrote something to the effect of "We're killing all the religious people." If you have something like that, I would LOVE to see it.

If you want evidence of a genocidal, murderous maniac, you need only look as far as the god of the christian bible who takes credit for slaughtering some 2.5 million people, if biblical 'history' is to be believed, and who delighted in it AND expected his followers to do the same; but just the men, babies and 'married' women. The virgins they were directed by this loving god to keep as 'spoils.'

Or, in more recent history, you can look to Britain, where people were killed by the thousands in the name of religion, alternately catholicism or protestantism, depending on who occupied the throne, without any evidence at all for the existence of the thing they were killing real, live humans for.

Jewish people have been persecuted in the most brutal way for 2000+ years for having "killed" a person for who there is NO evidence of existence! If your family was tried and convicted on the most sketchy, easily disproved 'evidence' for generations! ... Think about that! An entire culture of people has been subjected to horrific treatment for more than 2000 years on NO EVIDENCE! It is outrageous, and I seriously question the morality of christians who make no effort to confirm the foundations of their beliefs - particularly the existence of their main character (who bears a very, very striking resemblance to about 25 other main characters) - yet accept this!

You and I both know there has never been and will never be a war or genocide in the name of "I have no beliefs in things for which there is no evidence." Scandinavian countries have VERY high rates of atheism and, correspondingly, high educational standards, excellent social and cultural standards, low rates of violence and crime - and are historically uninvolved in wars..... so, yeah.

Like I said, I read my ass off. Every day. I follow people and feeds and blog writers who make this stuff their life's research; I read books, I talk to folks, I listen to various talks (TED is a great resource). I get all sorts of "you're wrong," and "you're insulting" and "you're disrespectful;" people tell me I have a 'belief' system but they don't or can't define it; but I DON'T get researched, linked, substantiation or information: I get opinions, "I was brought up like this," and "respect my 'religion,'" NOT research. Atheism is a 'belief' system like "off" is a TV channel. I was brought up like this too but to not question one's 'faith' is frankly morally bankrupt.

INFORMATION, evidence and proof. Simple. Otherwise, I and the guy with the strainer have JUST as much evidence for our positions as does a person from any other paradigm.

Something like 20% of north Americans are atheists (those that are "out") which means that 20% of north Americans are evidence-based thinkers. If I were the pope or an imam or a minister, I would make it my life's work to find EVIDENCE because holy cow, what a coup it would be to win over all those souls.